Comments on: Reconsidering Iraq http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/ Refunds Cheerfully Given To All Who Disagree Sat, 07 Apr 2012 09:00:47 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Swords Crossed » Iraq: War and Politics - Part 2 http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-22915 Swords Crossed » Iraq: War and Politics - Part 2 Mon, 01 May 2006 15:15:22 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-22915 [...] At Red State, they write: You hear a lot these days about war fatigue. I’m feeling it myself–we’re three years into the mission and I am getting fed up. Fed up with the sanctimonious anti-war left, who in the absence of smoking stockpiles of WMD are unwilling or unable to understand the value of a free and stable Iraq and fed up with the equally short-sighted conservatives among whom it is now fashionable to recant earlier support for the Iraq war and declare its failure according to their new-found “historical” perspective. Hindsight is of course supposed to be 20/20, but I am wondering if enough time has yet gone by to give anyone such clarity of vision. At the end of the week, Mark Coffey had two interesting posts (here and here) on the changing political landscape in Iraq that led me to reflect on the state of our ongoing “dialogue” over the decision to invade, which seems to focus alternately on whether we were right or wrong to go in given what is happening in the country now and on the dubious merits of the post-war reconstruction effort. I put dialogue in quotes because it seems to me that there’s precious little debate going on. Pervading “conventional wisdom,” to quote John Kenneth Galbraith, holds that we were wrong and reconstruction has failed. The administration went in without a plan and stubbornly refused to develop one out of stupidity or arrogance. Because of unresolvable sectarian differences that we should have known about going in, the government-that-never-was is a shambles, civil war is raging, and it’s only a matter of time before a pro-Iran ultra-conservative theocracy takes power. The Iraqi security forces are a disaster, if they exist at all. . . . Such conventional wisdom has become the foundation of accepted truth on which most discussions of Iraq now build. What amazes me is the certitude of those who have been willing–even eager–to throw in the towel and declare failure over the last six months. [...] [...] At Red State, they write: You hear a lot these days about war fatigue. I’m feeling it myself–we’re three years into the mission and I am getting fed up. Fed up with the sanctimonious anti-war left, who in the absence of smoking stockpiles of WMD are unwilling or unable to understand the value of a free and stable Iraq and fed up with the equally short-sighted conservatives among whom it is now fashionable to recant earlier support for the Iraq war and declare its failure according to their new-found “historical” perspective. Hindsight is of course supposed to be 20/20, but I am wondering if enough time has yet gone by to give anyone such clarity of vision. At the end of the week, Mark Coffey had two interesting posts (here and here) on the changing political landscape in Iraq that led me to reflect on the state of our ongoing “dialogue” over the decision to invade, which seems to focus alternately on whether we were right or wrong to go in given what is happening in the country now and on the dubious merits of the post-war reconstruction effort. I put dialogue in quotes because it seems to me that there’s precious little debate going on. Pervading “conventional wisdom,” to quote John Kenneth Galbraith, holds that we were wrong and reconstruction has failed. The administration went in without a plan and stubbornly refused to develop one out of stupidity or arrogance. Because of unresolvable sectarian differences that we should have known about going in, the government-that-never-was is a shambles, civil war is raging, and it’s only a matter of time before a pro-Iran ultra-conservative theocracy takes power. The Iraqi security forces are a disaster, if they exist at all. . . . Such conventional wisdom has become the foundation of accepted truth on which most discussions of Iraq now build. What amazes me is the certitude of those who have been willing–even eager–to throw in the towel and declare failure over the last six months. [...]

]]> By: Mark http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-21069 Mark Thu, 27 Apr 2006 19:37:13 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-21069 Thank you very much, Sgt., and God bless you and all our wonderful troops... Thank you very much, Sgt., and God bless you and all our wonderful troops…

]]> By: Sgt Garth Gehlen http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-21051 Sgt Garth Gehlen Thu, 27 Apr 2006 19:31:04 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-21051 My name is Sgt Gehlen from the U.S. Centrasl Command Public Affairs office. A transcript of the Zarqawi message can be found in the "What Extremists Are Saying" section of the CENTCOM website: www.centcom.mil My name is Sgt Gehlen from the U.S. Centrasl Command Public Affairs office. A transcript of the Zarqawi message can be found in the “What Extremists Are Saying” section of the CENTCOM website: http://www.centcom.mil

]]> By: Mark http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-21002 Mark Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:59:58 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-21002 Oh, hell, one more thought, again...'what we have accomplished' with the new PM? Who's we? He's not a figurehead, he's a compromise figure chosen by the Iraqis to break the months-long impasse since the last elections. Winning in Iraq is not imposing a U.S. figurehead...it's bringing real democratic change to the Mideast, even if the result is an unfriendly government. An unfriendly, but democratic government, is, in fact, probably the best we can hope for... Oh, hell, one more thought, again…’what we have accomplished’ with the new PM? Who’s we? He’s not a figurehead, he’s a compromise figure chosen by the Iraqis to break the months-long impasse since the last elections.

Winning in Iraq is not imposing a U.S. figurehead…it’s bringing real democratic change to the Mideast, even if the result is an unfriendly government. An unfriendly, but democratic government, is, in fact, probably the best we can hope for…

]]> By: Mark http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-21001 Mark Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:57:06 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-21001 And just one more thought - of course, there are the terrorists, and of course the casualty count is still terribly high...but the terrorists have been nearly completely marginalized now, as far as public support and sympathy - and that was the larger point of both AJ and the WaPo, I believe... And just one more thought – of course, there are the terrorists, and of course the casualty count is still terribly high…but the terrorists have been nearly completely marginalized now, as far as public support and sympathy – and that was the larger point of both AJ and the WaPo, I believe…

]]> By: Mark http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-20998 Mark Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:49:08 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-20998 HenryH, I don't claim we are not at war...I thought I was very explicit about that...AJ states it stronger than I would, but it's still an important counterweight to those elements (stronger on the left) who still talk about a 'resistance' in Iraq. There is no resistance, really, to speak off, there are struggling factions, but it's not the U.S. presence that they are struggling over, it's who gets the lion's share of power. Is that new? Yes, I think it is... Is it perfect? Of course not...but it beats the days when you could really speak of a true 'resistance'... HenryH, I don’t claim we are not at war…I thought I was very explicit about that…AJ states it stronger than I would, but it’s still an important counterweight to those elements (stronger on the left) who still talk about a ‘resistance’ in Iraq. There is no resistance, really, to speak off, there are struggling factions, but it’s not the U.S. presence that they are struggling over, it’s who gets the lion’s share of power.

Is that new? Yes, I think it is…

Is it perfect? Of course not…but it beats the days when you could really speak of a true ‘resistance’…

]]> By: HenryH http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-20988 HenryH Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:16:38 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-20988 Excuse me? How is the situation different, with regards to whether we are "at war with Iraq" or not, as a function of the nature of their govenment? Is it not the case that Iraq has been governed by American allies for nearly three years now? Were we "at war with Iraq" when Paul Bremer was in charge? When Allawi was PM? When al-Jaffari was PM - by way of an earlier election? AJ is spouting nonsense, and all you do is nod. With the new PM, what we have accomplished is to establish, in the highest levels of their government, someone with close personal and historical ties to Syria, to go along with all the others there who have such relationships with Iran. Excuse me? How is the situation different, with regards to whether we are “at war with Iraq” or not, as a function of the nature of their govenment?

Is it not the case that Iraq has been governed by American allies for nearly three years now? Were we “at war with Iraq” when Paul Bremer was in charge? When Allawi was PM? When al-Jaffari was PM – by way of an earlier election?

AJ is spouting nonsense, and all you do is nod.

With the new PM, what we have accomplished is to establish, in the highest levels of their government, someone with close personal and historical ties to Syria, to go along with all the others there who have such relationships with Iran.

]]> By: AcademicElephant http://informedspeculation.com/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-20983 AcademicElephant Thu, 27 Apr 2006 15:55:12 +0000 http://decision08.net/2006/04/27/reconsidering-iraq/#comment-20983 Again I find myself wondering what the other side of the aisle will do if, God forbid, Bush was right. Maybe I should have been a psychologist. Again I find myself wondering what the other side of the aisle will do if, God forbid, Bush was right.

Maybe I should have been a psychologist.

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